Topic: WorldMax DSS Mounts

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1.WorldMax DSS Mounts Copy to clipboard
Posted by: hazer911
Posted on: Feb 24, 2007 3:19 PM

Hi,

I am considering building myself a drumset using Keller shells, and I just had a question about ISO mounts. On the RIMS website, it talks about some rip-off iso's that warp drum shells. Do the WorldMax DSS's warp the shells or put them out of round? The DSS's seemed so much cheaper than the RIMS, but it's obviously no savings if they mess the shells. Also, are there any other good aftermarket ISO's?

Thanks a lot,

Andy

2.Re:WorldMax DSS Mounts [Re: hazer911] Copy to clipboard
Posted by: moneyowen
Posted on: Feb 25, 2007 1:36 PM

Gary Gauger invented the RIMS system (Resonanace Isolation Mounting System) It works.
He got a patent on it. He tried to shop it around to all the drum manufactuers, and didn't get a lot of response. Pearl drums even went so far as to say they wouldn't install it as original equipment, because it would imply the drums didn't function properly without them. The studio guys all used them, and RIMS is kind of strange in that it is designed to retrofit on any existing drum. What the manufacturers did was all stroke their beards, and wait until the patent rights expired (I think it's 12 years?) Then lo and behold, they all "invented" their own version of the same thing. Pearl ISS and later Opti mount, Yamaha YESS (yamaha enhanced sustain system) get half credit for at least making it not look like a RIMS. Tama Starcast was built under agreement from Gauger. But Cannon, Worldmax, Ludwig, Premier, Gretsch (kaman) and others are blatant copies. Ironically, Gretsch was one of the only to offer RIMS as an option on their lines. But like other custom builders, Gretsch will install Tama Yama or whomever's hardware you want on their lines (the original Gretsch built in Savannah GA, not the import stuff)

So Gauger has to protect their interest. They (he) did invent the dammed thing. So, as with other products, they say "only the original will work, any other is just imitation (which it is..) and will damage your shells and home and car and life or whatever" IMO FWIW, I don't think it's true. I have WorldMax RIMS clones on my Tempus kit, and they work just fine. As do the Gretsch copies I own. I also have some of the older and the new RIMS. The others are all copies. They just hang the drum off the tension rods. I can't see how it could possibly warp the shells or cause any other damage. Or you can still buy them from Gary if you want to www.gaugerpercussion.com The WorldMax are a lot cheaper, thats for sure.

hope this helps some, yo.

3.Re:WorldMax DSS Mounts [Re: hazer911] Copy to clipboard
Posted by: hazer911
Posted on: Feb 26, 2007 1:44 PM

Thanks for the reply. Really helps out. I kinda thought they were full of horse crap, but I figured someone on here might say there was some little design flaw that could mess the shells. Also, is it possible to hang the drum from underneath the top lugs by using two-sided snare lugs on the mounting lugs? I'm going to use Ego Rounded lugs, and was thinking of a two-sided rounded for mounting. It would look pretty sweet, IMO

4.Re:WorldMax DSS Mounts [Re: hazer911] Copy to clipboard
Posted by: moneyowen
Posted on: Mar 1, 2007 8:03 AM

Yes, if you have a lug, like you mentioned, that will receive a t rod from underneath, such as an Ego or snare type lug, you can mount it this way. Noble & Cooley does this on their CD Maples line. I hope this answers your question.


5.Re:WorldMax DSS Mounts [Re: hazer911] Copy to clipboard
Posted by: hazer911
Posted on: Mar 3, 2007 7:42 PM

Thanks a ton man.

6.Re:WorldMax DSS Mounts [Re: hazer911] Copy to clipboard
Posted by: peppone
Posted on: Jan 11, 2008 1:41 AM

hi, thanks for the post and answers to it. its the only one in the western world IMO

7.Re:WorldMax DSS Mounts [Re: hazer911] Copy to clipboard
Posted by: OldFart
Posted on: Jan 11, 2008 5:09 AM

Money is the Man !

My Mapex Saturns have an Iso mount. Theirs is no copy of the RIMS original, as far as I can see; but I'm not fully conversant in drum history. Premier, Gretsch and perhaps a few others have a nice extension of their Tube lug design where there is some tubing spanning the Batter side lugs with the Reso side lugs; then across that is a plate upon which is fixed the mount hardware. The old Signia had that, and I think that's been copied by Gretsch's New Classic kits (I think that's what they're called?).

My Mapex mounts are designed to sit under the lug (the Tom mount being mated to a bar that spans two lugs, the center of which is raised from the drum shell such that it only touches the shell in an area the size of the lug). The thinking is that since you need to attach the lug somehow anyway, the Iso mount has a footprint only slightly larger than the lug footprint, so sharing that one hole serves the two purposes. I should add that Mapex lugs are single point - meaning they only require one screw to attach the lug housing.

The Iso mount is very low profile; I don't think it protrudes out from the shell any further than the drum rim/hoop. It's simple and elegant looking. It doesn't require any special RIMs mount drum cases - standard cases work. On the other hand, RIMS extend out from the edge of the Hoop and beyond the lug housing; and they involve four lugs.

None of this is to "Dis" the RIMS original, but rather to show how the same basic idea has morphed.

OldFart

8.Re:WorldMax DSS Mounts [Re: hazer911] Copy to clipboard
Posted by: Densbak
Posted on: Jan 11, 2008 9:29 AM

I've had both RIMS mounts, and Pacifics versions of them. I always wondered about the ill effects of mounting a drum by it's tension rods. In my case I noted nothing out of the ordinary, other than a minute amount of added decay to my mounted toms. If you can't tune your drums well, then any mount will work. I also noted that when I had my drums tuned very well to themselves, and I then mounted them to the kit, the tuning would go out right away. There must be some kind of bending that happens. whether it be the screws, the shells, or the hoops being slightly warped by the weight of the drum, not to mention the drum being hit, and the tension screws taking the brunt of the weight when struck repeatedly.

Just my views.

9.Re:WorldMax DSS Mounts [Re: Densbak] Copy to clipboard
Posted by: OldFart
Posted on: Jan 11, 2008 11:09 AM

Densbak wrote:
I've had both RIMS mounts, and Pacifics versions of them. I always wondered about the ill effects of mounting a drum by it's tension rods. In my case I noted nothing out of the ordinary, other than a minute amount of added decay to my mounted toms. If you can't tune your drums well, then any mount will work. I also noted that when I had my drums tuned very well to themselves, and I then mounted them to the kit, the tuning would go out right away. There must be some kind of bending that happens. whether it be the screws, the shells, or the hoops being slightly warped by the weight of the drum, not to mention the drum being hit, and the tension screws taking the brunt of the weight when struck repeatedly.

Just my views.


I know I'm flogging the horse by bringing this up again, and I really don't mean to wear anyone out, but the Mapex Iso mount totally solves the side-effect of hanging a drum from its tension rods.

You can see how unobtrusive it is here (I hope ... the "Finishes" and the larger photos are both slideshows, so after a few seconds you'll see mounts ) :



Click here to open a new window

After my post above, I went to the site to confirm that they're low-profile, but I stand corrected that they protrude a little bit beyond the Hoop and Lugs.

As you can see the drum is supported and the head is not affected because the tension rods aren't under stress.

Edit : Added later -

You'll also note this same treatment appears on Floor Tom leg mounts and Bass Spur mounts - all Mapex style Iso mounts.

OldFart

10.Re:WorldMax DSS Mounts [Re: hazer911] Copy to clipboard
Posted by: moneyowen
Posted on: Jan 11, 2008 11:40 AM

Solid Mapex innovation. Not at all like Premier Signia, or even DW STM



Please note: I am not trying to dis you, or Mapex, or WorldMax or anyone or anything else. I have drums with absolutely NO suspension mounts at all! and they function perfectly well. As do some with suspension mounts. Gauger invented RIMS. He tried to get all the majors to buy from him. Basically no one did (almost) but they all came up with their own version, and all are based on at least the same concept. The notion that one type warps shells, or hanging from a tension rod is inherently bad, or that hanging from a tension casing (lug) is somehow better is mostly a bunch of voodoo.
Nowadays, even low line drums have some version of suspended mount, because we all think it's necessary. It's not.

11.Re:WorldMax DSS Mounts [Re: hazer911] Copy to clipboard
Posted by: Densbak
Posted on: Jan 12, 2008 2:11 PM

I agree. I think we all fell for a marketing ploy to sway us into thinking that mounting drums by other than the shell would "greatly" improve the sound of any drum. That's not entirely a falsehood though. The amount of added sustain or decay is hardly noticable, even with the best ears. But I'm sure it'll give us enough armor to use in an argument over it. Therein lies the marketing effect.

Who first created it should be credited though, and Gary deserves his rights. He was only trying to help and improve the drumming community.

12.Re:WorldMax DSS Mounts [Re: Densbak] Copy to clipboard
Posted by: pwc
Posted on: Jan 12, 2008 2:14 PM

I have always wanted to find a new way to have rack toms with legs as that seems to really help floor toms .... 'course you could no longer call them rack or mounted toms ....I thought of calling them Mountie toms with hooves on the leg bottoms.

13.Re:WorldMax DSS Mounts [Re: moneyowen] Copy to clipboard
Posted by: kudoco
Posted on: Jan 12, 2008 11:05 PM

moneyowen wrote:
Solid Mapex innovation. Not at all like Premier Signia, or even DW STM





I love the look of that drum.

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